Comments on: Optimism in my pessimism http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/ Sun, 07 Sep 2008 00:12:10 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.2 By: Jacob Munoz http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6267 Jacob Munoz Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:20:55 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6267 I'll go out on a limb here and say that I DO think aliens have (or perhaps currently do) pass through our system. We may simply not be significant enough (technologically, evolution-wise, or culturally) for them to feel the need to 'speak' to us - they just drive by like we drive past cows. Our oceans are a convenient 'refueling stop' - and many UFO sightings involve fast lights 'flying' through water (a method of supercavitation allows for this), so perhaps we're just a mossy blue gas station to them. Or you could go down the pessimistic route of this and say they refuse to speak to us because of our behaviour. Maybe they once used-to work with ancient humans, but we got greedy and violent and now their afraid we'll misuse their technology if we get the chance - so they give us the 'silent treatment'... Anything's possible, but for us to be absolutely alone is the nearest thing to impossible. I’ll go out on a limb here and say that I DO think aliens have (or perhaps currently do) pass through our system. We may simply not be significant enough (technologically, evolution-wise, or culturally) for them to feel the need to ’speak’ to us - they just drive by like we drive past cows. Our oceans are a convenient ‘refueling stop’ - and many UFO sightings involve fast lights ‘flying’ through water (a method of supercavitation allows for this), so perhaps we’re just a mossy blue gas station to them.

Or you could go down the pessimistic route of this and say they refuse to speak to us because of our behaviour. Maybe they once used-to work with ancient humans, but we got greedy and violent and now their afraid we’ll misuse their technology if we get the chance - so they give us the ’silent treatment’…

Anything’s possible, but for us to be absolutely alone is the nearest thing to impossible.

]]> By: The Blue http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6260 The Blue Sun, 09 Mar 2008 18:59:02 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6260 I watched the "Out of the Blue" UFO documentary linked in your other post. Definitely interesting stuff. They have a website <a href="http://www.outofthebluethemovie.com/" rel="nofollow">here</a>. I watched the “Out of the Blue” UFO documentary linked in your other post.

Definitely interesting stuff. They have a website here.

]]> By: Dave Rosky http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6242 Dave Rosky Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:13:45 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6242 I had a bad typo in my last post. Where it says "largours", it should say "our society". I had a bad typo in my last post. Where it says “largours”, it should say “our society”.

]]> By: Dave Rosky http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6241 Dave Rosky Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:11:44 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6241 Like you, I believe that it is extremely likely that there is intelligent life outside of earth. As others have pointed out, however, there are numerous reasons why they may not have visited us. The famous "Drake Equation" contains several quantities that are difficult to pin down to even within several orders of magnitude. The thing I would like to add, though, is that even if other intelligent life *is* very sparse in the galaxy, it doesn't necessarily have to spell certain doom for us. There are likely far more *habitable* planets out there than *inhabited* ones. We don't necessarily need to find inhabited planets to survive, just habitable ones. The real question, of course, is whether the economics, politics, and psychology of largours will ultimately allow for the decision to go and colonize those habitable worlds. That's where I'm the most pessimistic - not whether we will someday be able to do it, but whether we will have the will to do it. Like you, I believe that it is extremely likely that there is intelligent life outside of earth. As others have pointed out, however, there are numerous reasons why they may not have visited us. The famous “Drake Equation” contains several quantities that are difficult to pin down to even within several orders of magnitude.

The thing I would like to add, though, is that even if other intelligent life *is* very sparse in the galaxy, it doesn’t necessarily have to spell certain doom for us. There are likely far more *habitable* planets out there than *inhabited* ones. We don’t necessarily need to find inhabited planets to survive, just habitable ones. The real question, of course, is whether the economics, politics, and psychology of largours will ultimately allow for the decision to go and colonize those habitable worlds. That’s where I’m the most pessimistic - not whether we will someday be able to do it, but whether we will have the will to do it.

]]> By: Nita http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6238 Nita Sun, 09 Mar 2008 01:02:25 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6238 I believe there does exist alien life somewhere in the universe besides just on Earth, and I do believe they are intelligent lifeforms too (of course, there would be less intelligent ones also) but I do not believe that they have ever visited Earth. I have not seen any even remotely believable evidence of such. But well, as to the reason why they might not have visited Earth can be almost anything: they're technological progression has just advanced in to completely other direction than ours, they might not have even tried to advance far technologically, they might live so far that their technology just isn't advanced enough to reach us (yet), or even they could just wish not to visit us at all before we can do space travel on our own.. Also let's not forget that we are aliens to them. So, it could just as well be that one day in the future we are the technologically superior race visiting other cultures. I believe there does exist alien life somewhere in the universe besides just on Earth, and I do believe they are intelligent lifeforms too (of course, there would be less intelligent ones also) but I do not believe that they have ever visited Earth. I have not seen any even remotely believable evidence of such.

But well, as to the reason why they might not have visited Earth can be almost anything: they’re technological progression has just advanced in to completely other direction than ours, they might not have even tried to advance far technologically, they might live so far that their technology just isn’t advanced enough to reach us (yet), or even they could just wish not to visit us at all before we can do space travel on our own..

Also let’s not forget that we are aliens to them. So, it could just as well be that one day in the future we are the technologically superior race visiting other cultures.

]]> By: Eugenia http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6237 Eugenia Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:31:54 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6237 >There are LOTS of reasons why aliens may have never visited us Indeed. But I prefer to think of the most obvious reason: because it's difficult to do so. And if that is the case, then we might be at the same shit too. >There are LOTS of reasons why aliens may have never visited us

Indeed. But I prefer to think of the most obvious reason: because it’s difficult to do so. And if that is the case, then we might be at the same shit too.

]]> By: Phil http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6235 Phil Sat, 08 Mar 2008 22:34:00 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6235 Yes, I agree there's life elsewhere in the universe, but despite an awful lot of cameras out there I've seen no credible visual evidence they've come here (the Aurora spy plane on the other hand). It seems the speed of light constraint is God's little way of telling us to mind our (and their) own business. As for the survival of the human race I've met enough of them to state that I don't really care ... ;) Yes, I agree there’s life elsewhere in the universe, but despite an awful lot of cameras out there I’ve seen no credible visual evidence they’ve come here (the Aurora spy plane on the other hand). It seems the speed of light constraint is God’s little way of telling us to mind our (and their) own business.

As for the survival of the human race I’ve met enough of them to state that I don’t really care … ;)

]]> By: Frank Miller http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6233 Frank Miller Sat, 08 Mar 2008 20:46:42 +0000 http://eugenia.gnomefiles.org/2008/03/08/optimism-in-my-pessimism/#comment-6233 Good heavens. While I follow your train of thought, I have lots of trouble with your logic. There are LOTS of reasons why aliens may have never visited us (yet, I believe they are out there too). The assumption that if they have not visited us its not possible for us to visit them either is just plain fallacy in logic. They teach this is a first year CS logic course, a->b does not mean b->a. And if we can't leave the planet en masse, it does not mean the death of the human race. It means there will ultimately be a maximum number of people that can exist here, thats all. I'm sorry you're such a pessimist. Were it that we could turn you to optimism! FM Good heavens. While I follow your train of thought, I have lots of trouble with your logic.

There are LOTS of reasons why aliens may have never visited us (yet, I believe they are out there too).

The assumption that if they have not visited us its not possible for us to visit them either is just plain fallacy in logic. They teach this is a first year CS logic course, a->b does not mean b->a.

And if we can’t leave the planet en masse, it does not mean the death of the human race. It means there will ultimately be a maximum number of people that can exist here, thats all.

I’m sorry you’re such a pessimist. Were it that we could turn you to optimism!

FM

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